Everything's Not Black & White
Life isn’t black and white—and neither are the issues shaping our lives and communities.
Hosted by LaLa and Brian, Everything's Not Black & White is a podcast dedicated to exploring the nuanced gray areas between opposing viewpoints. Behind every strong opinion is an individual's story, backstory, and lived experience that shaped how they see the world.
Join us as we trade knee-jerk reactions for curious questions. We dive into today’s trending topics to understand why people feel the way they do, creating a space for respectful, honest dialogue that bridges divides instead of deepening them.
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Everything's Not Black & White
Beyond Burnout: The Nap Concert Revolution - Elizabeth Wangugi Etienne
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Lachandra and Brian sit down with wellness strategist Elizabeth Wangugi Etienne (Ellie) to explore the vital connection between rest and human-centered leadership. Challenging "hustle" culture, Ellie discusses longevity thinking, the art of recovery, and reframing burnout as a natural grieving process. This conversation offers a roadmap for reclaiming personal agency and serves as a preview for the Confidence Lab Summit on May 4th, 2026, and the next live NAP Concert on November 14th, 2026.
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Everything's Not Black & White
Beyond Burnout: The Nap Concert Revolution - Elizabeth Wangugi Etienne
Episode Transcript
Intro Announcement: Welcome to Everything's Not Black and White with your hosts, Lala and Brian.
Lala: Hello everyone, and welcome to today's episode. I am super excited because today's conversation is something I've been looking forward to for quite some time. It sits right at the intersection of something we all need a lot more of: rest, restoration, and real, human-centered leadership.
I am joined today by my incredible friend Elizabeth Wangugi Etienne—a corporate wellness strategist, community builder, and the visionary behind the NAP Concert. Yes, you heard that right! A full experience designed to help us pause, rest, and reconnect with ourselves in a way that actually moves the needle in our lives and our work.
Elizabeth has spent over a decade helping people and organizations rethink how we approach burnout, engagement, and energy—not as buzzwords, but as real, measurable outcomes that impact how we show up every day. The best part? We are both stepping into this work together at the upcoming Confidence Lab Summit on May 4th, 2026. This conversation is your front-row preview of what's possible when you stop running on empty and start leading from a place of restoration.
Elizabeth, or as I call her, Ellie, welcome! We're so glad you're here.
Ellie: Thank you guys so much for having me. I feel blessed.
Lala: Well, we are blessed to have you and your voice in this room. Let's start with a question before we even dive into your work: What does rest mean to you right now in this season of your life?
Ellie: For me right now, rest is being in community—which seems counterintuitive because people can sometimes be physically and emotionally draining. But in a time where systems are specifically built to extract value from you, chew you up, and spit you out, it will be community that saves us all.
Lala: I love that you say that because, even though we're six years past COVID, the isolation from that time really set us back in human development. People are so beholden to social media, algorithms, and echo chambers that we've lost that sense of being in real community. How do you think about rest and community when people are so overwhelmed by information that they become paralyzed?
Ellie: In the information age, ignorance really is bliss. What you don't know can't hurt you, whereas knowing too much can walk you right down a path toward depression.
It's really important to feel needed, but not feel used. That is a fine line to walk. What keeps me going is knowing there are people out there who aren't just rooting for me, but are actively helping me succeed.
A lot of systems set you up for failure and then get mad at you when you fail. I don't operate well under that—when I'm set up to fail in a broken system, I fail spectacularly! The only antidote I've ever experienced is finding people who see those broken systems and say, "Here's what I did, here's how I can help, and I have a vested interest in your success." That's the only thing I want to participate in.
Lala: Whether you call yourself an ally, advocate, or champion, how you show up in those high-pressure moments is where you actually earn that title. True allies don't sabotage or root for your failure; they remove barriers for your success.
Ellie: If you're a person who has ever struggled to feel worthy, having people support you when they didn't have to becomes a staple in your worthiness journey.
Lala: Worthiness and burnout are deeply connected to systemic issues. How does your work help people navigate those systems and recover from burnout?
Ellie: Burnout is incredibly natural—almost 100% of working adults experience it. I believe the midlife crisis is often just an expression of burnout; it's reconciling that the life you expected to have didn't happen.
Burnout begins with a grieving process. If you go through burnout restoration in a healthy way, it looks like grieving the expectations that didn't come to pass and healing from that. The unhealthy path is becoming numbed, colder, angrier, and sadder.
The full grieving process ends when you let those unfulfilled expectations die and become accepting of reality. But that's hard because, especially in American culture, we're conditioned to work until we die and constantly push through.
Lala: Our bodies aren't designed for this level of continuous hardship. The mental overload alone burns people out. So many of us have forgotten how to recover or don't have recovery practices.
In my own life, I'm never afraid to make a mistake because I trust in my ability to learn from it and recover. But the art of recovery is lost because everyone expects fast results.
Ellie: When you move too fast, you break things. I lost over 100 pounds in two years, and because I was pushing myself too fast, I broke things and had to start back at square one.
When you rush, you forget essential steps—whether in health, corporate systems, or politics. Recovery requires time, rest, consulting experts, and being willing to learn from what happened. The reasons we stay consistently burnt out are because we've forgotten the act of recovery and underestimate how long it takes.
Brian: I work out with a friend who's in her 60s, but my ego can't turn off the competition—if she does six reps, I want to do ten! Is there a sign before you hit physical or mental pain where you can turn that competitive drive off?
Ellie: It's hard to turn off competition because it's an ego response. The key is to go even slower.
When you're moving quickly, there is a delay in the biofeedback between your brain, spine, and muscles. By the time your brain processes the strain in your shoulder during a lift, you've already completed the rep, and the damage is done.
In power yoga and strength training, I make people work under slow, controlled tension so they receive real-time biofeedback. The "control" is the conversation your mind has with your body, and the "slow" is giving that conversation time to register.
Brian: Usually my coach just tells me to quit crying and suck it up, but I'll try to interpret it differently next time!
Lala: That "go fast, quick results" mindset is built into corporate culture—especially with quarterly earnings calls. How do you help corporate leaders shift from fast-paced burnout to sustainable recovery?
Ellie: In two conversations with a CEO, I can tell whether they have longevity thinking or if they're building the next unstable startup that will crash. I ask them directly: "Do you want to be Uber or do you want to be Ford?"
Uber burned through CEOs, faced structural collapses, and extracted value from people. Ford has been around for over a century because they put structures in place for longevity. Strategically minded CEOs understand that the solid foundation of any business is its people—its human resources. Longevity thinking builds a solid foundation slow and steady, like the Grand Canyon.
Lala: Let's talk about the Nap Concert. I love Tricia Hersey's book Rest Is Resistance and her work with the Nap Ministry. How did the Nap Concert come to be?
Ellie: It was an expression of how I wished business could be done. As a event producer in the corporate wellness space, I was tired of going to networking events fueled by coffee, pastries, and speed-dating value extraction. I would come home and crash on my couch for six hours, completely depleted.
Around that time, NASA had resurrected a study prescribing naps to astronauts because even people working their dream jobs were burning out. I decided we needed to do business differently.
Inspired by composer Max Richter's eight-hour sleep concerts in NYC, I worked with our mutual friend, Stephanie Matthews, to design the ultimate power-nap experience. We combined acoustic music, aromatherapy, art therapy, sound healing, and nourishing food to create an environment where people could safely rest.
The first Nap Concert sold out instantly, and so did the second! People are exhausted by boring panels and value extraction—they just want to come together, experience joy, and get real rest.
Lala: Drawing the line at 53 years old, if something doesn't promote peace, joy, or healing, I'm not doing it! To give value to others, I have to be in constant recovery.
Brian: How do you manage taking time off as an entrepreneur without feeling like you're neglecting the business?
Ellie: I financially incentivize myself to stay healthy and well. Because I work in wellness, if I'm putting on weight, crashing in front of the TV, or burning out, it directly impacts my business.
I train physically and mentally through Pilates, yoga, and lifting to build the strength needed to resist the pressures of the world. I only produce one major event a quarter, spending the time in between resting, staying healthy, and connecting with community without trying to extract value from them.
Lala: Tell us what listeners can expect from your session at the Confidence Lab Summit on May 4th, 2026.
Ellie: I will be speaking on Sustainable Agency.
Growing up in the Roe v. Wade era and now living in the post-Roe era, exercising agency is about knowing that as a Black woman, I hold freedom over my body, thoughts, and actions. Agency is a muscle—if you don't exercise it regularly, it will wane and die.
It's about choosing to stand up when people try to silence or censor you. You have to exercise your free will and stand up to those who wish to see you silenced. That is a core part of overcoming burnout.
Lala: Your agency gives you the ability to speak up, accept any consequences, learn from them, and recover.
Ellie: If you don't believe in your inner constitution to recover from a mistake, you will always bend in submission to others because you don't believe you have the ability to recover.
Lala: Fire! That is a mic-drop moment right there, Ellie! People get stuck in fear of not standing up for themselves, which turns into shame and takes away their confidence.
The Confidence Lab Summit on May 4th, 2026, is for anyone who has ever felt silenced, out of control, or afraid to stand up for themselves. How often are these events held?
Lala: We hold quarterly meetups and an annual summit with a year-long curriculum. Members even receive a one-hour session with each summit speaker—meaning you can work directly with Ellie on recovery and agency!
Plus, the next Nap Concert is scheduled for November 14th, 2026—our winter acoustic jazz sleep concert!
Ellie, if people want to connect with you and follow your work, where can they find you?
Ellie: I am @BizWitchDoc on all social platforms! Known as the "Business Witch Doctor" because of my mystical methods like the Nap Concert backed by proven corporate results. I'm most active on TikTok, Instagram, and LinkedIn.
Lala: Thank you so much for sharing your wisdom and energy with us today, Ellie!
Brian, how can our listeners stay connected with the podcast?
Brian: You can email us at embwpodcast@gmail.com, and follow us on Instagram and Facebook!
Lala: Make sure to get your tickets for the May 4th Confidence Lab Summit in the show notes below. Have a great day, everybody!
Brian: See ya! Bye!
